Bastian Venthur notices how the "How many bugs have you fixed today" question is used as a killer-argument against critism at the release-process.
I must confess that I also don't like this attitude of people to use such arguments as a form to silence others. It is something that only people should do, who enjoyed bad manners.
But OTOH it is really sad to see that always the same people are fixing rc bugs. I can only guess, but it seems like out of over 1000 developers eventually 100 are actively involved in the squashing of release-critical-bugs. That is a shame. And people who try to blame the release team for the consequences happening because of this only aren't really helpful, too. Its not like having a release team is meant to be a "5 people to rule/rescue the world" approach.
Bastian, the problem with your attitude is, that you adduct such arguments with it. If its not visible that you do anything more to get Lenny out, except pointing with the finger at the release team, saying "Ha! Ha!", and speculating how we will fail to release Lenny timely, then you shouldn't wonder. You should remember that you are a part of the "We", which is failing, when we as a project miss yet another release date.
And yes, I do agree that our release process is not really ideal and I think we should further push changes to optimize it (which already happened, given that the unblock-policy was way less strict as the years before), but where is your constructive contribution to that?
Tuesday, December 16, 2008
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2 comments:
Actually, I'm not pointing my finger at the release team and blaming them (or someone else) that we release too late. I don't care if we release too late, my critique was that we don't inform *our users* that we will release too late even when it's obvious.
I also criticized that unstable is frozen for way too long now, but again no critique in the direction to the release team or someone else.
Regarding my contribution, please read -devel, where I made a suggestion how to optimize the current release process. If that doesn't count since it's not fixing RC bugs, than sorry.
Well, Bastian, its not like you couldn't write up a mail, hand it to the release team to verify it, and let them send it around. Releasing as it is currently keeps people busy. Thats it. Writing a mail takes time, which is lost for other things.
Well, for our users, its not that bad that unstable is frozen that long. Whats really bad for them is that a Debian release is already outdated when it gets released. So it does not help much to handle Unstable different as of now.
Well, I've read your discussion contributions on -devel, but you might understand that a discussion about our release problematics is not helping much when we are overdue with our release. Its not that this discussion is not needed. But its the MOST WORST point in time that one can choose. And yes, discussing about how we can make it better for lenny+1 is NOT a contribution to getting the CURRENT release out the door.
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